Bored enough this morning that I'm working on the preliminary version of NCCS' Hardcore Mode again.
Three lines of dialogue per companion (one response for each 'tier' of survival skill); times nineteen possible options, equals a metric fucktonne of dialogue (the metric, or "long" fucktonne, of course being more than the Imperial, or "short" fuckton).
I have to say, this right here is what keeps me from doing more with the companion system. Dialogue.
I hate it. The editor is clumsy and slow, has a shitty excuse for a spell-checker that can't be turned off; and all-round takes forever. It isn't even hard -- it's just the sheer, mindless, monotony of the endless copying and editing.
It's comparably simple, no less -- my personal companions plugin has three companions in it. Each one gets her own dedicated set of responses.
NCCS will be... more complicated. I figure an odd half dozen randomized responses based on gender, alignment, and so on; plus extra responses for each of the seven new personality types -- and a few extras for alignments and genders within said personalities -- all times three for the tiers of survival skill and scripting aside, this is going to end up a not insubstantial amount of work.
It's times like this I wish I really was head of a multinational evil corporation. I'd type up a couple of templates, and have a couple of slaves whittle away their life on the remainder. I'd make a joke here about the market rate for a pair of third world children, but someone would probably think I was being serious and take great offense.
...Like I could afford to buy human beings these days anyway...
At least third world children would likely do a better job than Bethesda or Obsidian.
ReplyDeleteWow. From the sound of it, the resulting plugin is going to be huge compared to previous versions.
Having made like 140 RR Scouts, I understand at least a fraction of the monotony you speak of. I wish you luck.
I'm surprised noone has tackled making replacements for parts of the construction kits of the various Beth games, especially since such a thing could be portable between them. Like a dialogue template compiler or something.
ReplyDeleteMaybe it's just that they're not quite painful enough to push someone that far.
BTW, I believe most software companies have slaves, they just call them contractors.
"I'm surprised noone has tackled making replacements for parts of the construction kits of the various Beth games, especially since such a thing could be portable between them. Like a dialogue template compiler or something.
ReplyDeleteMaybe it's just that they're not quite painful enough to push someone that far."
Sadly, Nos R idjit n cant progrm wel nuf 2 du tht knda stuf.
Well, push someone with the programming skills needed :)
ReplyDeleteUnless Herculine has been skillfully hiding a skillset from me for the last couple years, I don't think I know anyone to rope into such a project.
ReplyDeleteInteresting... I mention someone doing third-party extensions for the SuCK (which seems to need them badly) and then I find it being mentioned here for the NV GECK. With my admittedly minimal exposure to the GECKs so far, even I have encountered things that could have been implemented better, and someone making a "plug-in" for it would do wonders for the functionality of the programs. Not to mention make some of the functions actually make sense finally...
ReplyDeleteI can also see how a mountain of work can put you off of actually tackling it Nos. I have similar responses to a number of my projects, and not just related to working with the game editors.
"I can also see how a mountain of work can put you off of actually tackling it Nos. I have similar responses to a number of my projects, and not just related to working with the game editors."
ReplyDeleteI'm going to be both selfish and blunt for a moment, and admit that it's not even the workload that puts me off, most days.
It's the almost total apathy from the community.
Have you looked at the FNV Nexus this month?
Current leader for file of the month: "Cheat Terminal". 669 endorsements. Over a hundred thousand downloads.
When all the community appreciates is bullshit cheat mods and "LOLGODWEPUN!" I look at the prospect of spending another couple dozen man-hours adding something cool to NCCS and taking my companions even further beyond the competition... and I wonder why I should bother.
The best, most versatile, and most complete plug 'n play companion system I've ever seen in any Gamebryo-based game has just over a third the endorsements of a "mod" that lets you cheat without anything so pedestrian as using the console.
At this point, the only thing that gets me to work on my publicly released mods anymore is my streak of perfectionism that doesn't want to leave anything half-finished.
Which is really a shame for the end users, because the fully-updated companions in my personal plugin blow every other companion I've ever seen so far out of the water that it isn't even funny.
Yeah, when you look at it that way, I can really understand why you wouldn't want to bother working on something :/ Which reminds me, I am a bit behind on my endorsing some more of the mods I'm using >.<
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, infrastructure tends to get taken for granted compared to the "Oooh, shiny!" stuff by the unwashed masses :(
ReplyDeleteIt's annoying, but that's why you just sniff disdainfully and call them philistines :)
"It's annoying, but that's why you just sniff disdainfully and call them philistines :)"
ReplyDeleteSo... either you have a keylogger on my system that has thus far escaped detection; or you have been reading my petty rantings entirely too long.
I had actually called them philistines (amongst other things) but at the last second though better of it and cleaned up the comment.
Nah, I've just been on the Internet far too long :)
ReplyDeleteI think I remember you actually calling someone a philistine somewhere here on you blog, Nos. I just can't remember to whom you were addressing in general.
ReplyDeleteI have called many philistine over the years, as it not only fits, but is well outside most folks' vocabulary.
ReplyDeleteNonetheless, I am trying to be less hateful in my posts and comments these days.
I absolutely still hate them, don't misunderstand; I'm just trying not to be as blatant about it.
So we have a slightly more political/diplomatic Nos? Interesting...
ReplyDeleteWe have a Nos who's tired of being harassed by morons that think bitching in my general direction will somehow get what they want.
ReplyDeleteI'm twenty-nine and already on ulcer number two. My bullshit limit is not nearly as high as it was back in 2000.
Well, from the sounds of things I'd stay off the Steam Workshop. Apparently the comments there make YouTube commenters sound like reasonable, rational people.
ReplyDeleteSounds like the appreciation I get from a certain other modding community. I totally understand getting discouraged; I've yet to begin or continue another project for that game despite my love for playing it mainly because I feel like it'd be a total waste of time and just asking for people to kick me in the head. Much like your personal companions, the last big mod I made for that game is something that I now hate to play the game without because I'm that proud of it and it works that well; I think I should've followed your lead and just kept that one to myself rather than release it publicly. Undeserving, ungrateful philistines...
ReplyDeletePersonally, I am happy that you did not keep it to yourself Herculine, but I realize that my support of it does not make up for the hoard of, umm, people that constantly put it down :( "Undeserving, ungrateful philistines..." Yes, yes they are.
ReplyDelete"We have a Nos who's tired of being harassed by morons that think bitching in my general direction will somehow get what they want."
Yeah, I can understand that. From the amount of mod threads I follow (and assist with) on the Nexus, I am surprised that more mod authors have not flipped out, or just plain packed it in, due to the amount of "problematic" mod users.
I've said it before, I'll say it again: I can understand ignorance; we all have to start somewhere, and I don't begrudge people asking questions, I really don't.
ReplyDeleteIt's that other group... the ones who are stupid, and proud of the fact; who patently refuse to learn, and throw the digital equivalent of a tantrum every time they don't their way.
I always imagine these people as the adult-ish form of the kids you see standing in the aisle at the grocery store screaming and throwing things to get a particular candy or cereal or whatever.
For example: that person who popped into the blog a few weeks ago to whine and cry and personally accuse me of being the reason his favorite crappy house mod -- a mod I hadn't even looked at in a year or so -- was pulled from the Nexus.
I'm not sure whether it's just chance, or the fact that I'm usually willing to help people for the asking; but I draw a lot of those individuals.
While I still want to make the game closer to my vision for it, that sort of thing is very draining and discouraging; and coupled with the very low percentage of players who are willing to take five seconds to endorse a mod, I find that I'm much happier and less frustrated just tinkering with mods for myself.
I've already got a half dozen plugins of my own for Skyrim, for example.